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First off, I am so, SO sorry for the sudden silence several months ago. I got swamped with lobbying campaigns during the end of the last Congress, on top of dealing with recurrent depression and social anxiety, and I was afraid as well that I’d crossed the line with my previous comment. Sorry for the acerbic tone, by the way, and thanks for the detailed explanations. You’ve put a lot of thought into your chronology.
I’m still adjusting my schedule so I’m not as overwhelmed, but I just wanted to let you know I read your responses and will be (slowly) getting back into leaving feedback. I also won’t be commenting on busy textures in the art anymore unless they’re especially egregious, since you’re reworking older pages anyway.
Oh, and by the way, remember how I previously kept mentioning a certain vital plot point that I felt wasn’t handled well? This was it.
I reread the sequence leading up to Rin’s arcane awakening, and I’m still scratching my head over why she is a waterbend—er, user of water magic. There’s no foreshadowing in the preceding acts for her connections to the ocean, nor any motifs or symbolism suggesting the sort. Not even her given name helps, nor her nicknames*. Apparently Rhiannon is partly derived from a Welsh root meaning “maiden”, and Rhiannon of the Mabinogi doesn’t seem to have any special affinity for the sea, as far as I can tell. And Rin can be written in so many different ways in Japanese, it’s just impossible to guess which kanji is involved (if any).
I’d buy into Rin as Sailor Mercury if she, oh I dunno, really liked spending time at the beach. Or often smelled like sea salt. Or had a preference for clothing colored like the ocean. Or was at least named after something aquatic, as Mizuno Ami and Undine Wells from Sleepless Domain are. But instead she suffers a near-death experience and is suddenly, conveniently rescued by a hitherto-absent thalassic deity who turns her into the Guardian of Water†. Yeah, I’m not convinced.
Anyway, I dunno if this is something you’re revising, but you might want to add it to the list. It’s a pretty jarring shift for Rin to go from being a normie to transforming into 🌊Alchemical Water 🌊.
*Technically Rhina counts…if you’re thinking of the shark genus. But it ultimately comes from Greek “rhínē”, “nose”. 🧐
†I read W.i.t.c.h. several years ago. What a waste of potential that series was, smh.
Hey! I’m glad to see you’re okay. I figured you had stuff to do, but was also a little worried (and debating on if I should check in and see if you were okay, but then I thought “is that weird and overstepping boundaries?” So I let it be. I don’t know what’s proper Internet etiquette XD But you were on my mind, and I was relieved just to see you were okay.
Nah, you’re fine. I’m sorry if at any point I came off as terse, too XD That’s not my intent. Sometimes I get busy and pour over my comments for like hours and then I look at the time and panic (last year was very busy. But this year should be a bit of relief once I take care of some unfinished business from last year). And as I’ve said before, no pressure from this side. Life is busy, life is fleeting. You’ve gotta do the things that matter to you while you can: your work and activism is important to you, and it’s good that you prioritize it.
At any rate, I hope things have been going well with the campaigning. If you feel like talking about that, I’d be interested if it was the work you were doing last time we talked. Don’t share anything you feel uncomfortable discussing, though.
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Sorry if I have typos. I read this a couple times, but I don’t have Word and the Notes program I use keeps autocorrecting everything D:
I reread the sequence leading up to Rin’s arcane awakening, and I’m still scratching my head over why she is a waterbend—er, user of water magic. There’s no foreshadowing in the preceding acts for her connections to the ocean, nor any motifs or symbolism suggesting the sort. Not even her given name helps, nor her nicknames*. Apparently Rhiannon is partly derived from a Welsh root meaning “maiden”, and Rhiannon of the Mabinogi doesn’t seem to have any special affinity for the sea, as far as I can tell. And Rin can be written in so many different ways in Japanese, it’s just impossible to guess which kanji is involved (if any) […].
Thank you for clarifying what was confusing to you! I don’t know if this will make anything clear or not, but this is another divergence from the way magical girls are done traditionally. Having read your comment, I can compromise only on doing better associating their colors with them, and I’ll explain the names and their importance below. Also, I’ll touch up on it, but there are characters who exhibit the elements and have names that in some way are reminiscent of the element. These two here 1.2. are the only ones we see so far, but they aren’t introduced until like…the next to the last series (or last series, if I decide that’s enough. I think I may just scrap the last one).
TL:DR—
I take my character’s names very seriously, as does I’m sure everyone. Their names have a purpose and meaning. And they are not dictated by an “innate” element. They choose the element, not vice versa (“choice” is important; there are characters named after their element, but that is rare because I place the symbolism on personality vs. powers; but that said, their powers are indicative of their personalities.
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SPOILERS! Don’t read if you don’t want spoilers! Thank you!
More Detailed Explanation—
(If you’d like more, let me know and I’ll email it. I don’t want too many spoilers, and I think this answers your question on why I chose each name.)
Names are not tied to the element: the elements are manifested by them. They are not controlled by a destiny of whatever element they manifest. While I appreciate other authors utilizing this trope, I have no desire to exhibit it in most cases. Other people have done this enough, and they can do it better than I can. I have the freedom to do other things with my characters’ names, and I intend to pack meaning elsewhere. And much of my symbolism is taken from the things I consumed in childhood, college, and the present. Dark Horse isn’t really like other magical girl comics, and I don’t want it to be. I love and enjoy the genre, but I don’t feel obligated to follow a formula. As mentioned, other people do better with that than I ever could. I have my own priorities.
Rhiannon as a character represents freedom and fluidity. She’s a pansexual* ‘90s hippie chick. She “goes with the flow” and she most identifies with the element water. She chose the element, not the other way around. Her element was not preordained by fate or someone else naming her; it was chosen by her, and reciprocated by the being who responded to her call. Her namesake was from a misinterpretation of the Welsh goddess of horses; Rhiannon was thought by many to be a “Welsh witch” because of the Fleetwood Mac song named after Triad by Mary Bartlett Leader. Her name is spot on for what I want her character to represent. It’s perfect to her because 1) Horses represent freedom and spirituality to western artists, as does the color blue. 2) The misinterpretation tells you from the get go Rin is a “magical girl” or witch. Even if Stevie Nicks initially made a mistake in thinking Rhiannon was a witch, most people who know the song know it’s about a witch. 3) The name is tied to a counter culture band of the 1960/70s (they were more poppy in the 80s), which implies a direct confrontation with societal norms. This is doubled because her parents named her after a “witch” in part because they love the song, they love the name, but in part as a reaction to being in the thick of the 1980s Satanic Panic, and they never “sold out.” It was a “middle finger” to mass hysteria. 4) Already having a lot of symbolism, Rhina herself loves the fact that she can choose between many nicknames; Rhina which feels more like her Gælic roots, or Rin which fits her Japanese roots. It, like her, is fluid. 5) Fluidity of personality is key to her element. She reached out to the being we see at the time of her awakening, because that being, whose *spoiler* called (“called” is important diction, as names have power and their true name is never given) Mizuna, is an embodiment of that element. Sidenote: Rin isn’t written with any kanji. She writes it with katakana (not hiragana). Because it’s the Japanese alphabet for foreign words, so that her that makes the most sense. She’s not a Japanese national, and she can’t read Japanese (beyond knowing a few words and phrases). She is a US citizen of mixed lineage.
Kanna as a character represents conformity. She’s a repressed teenager who’s been conditioned into guilt and conforming to what society believes she should be. She isn’t the light, but she choses light as her element because she is trying to fill the expectation of being a “good” “holy” person, while failing because the standard of “purity” is unrealistic and unattainable. But part of why she does this, and why the being who responds to her answers, is that deep down she does love and care for people, which is her true reason for putting so much pressure on herself. Two things can be true at once.
Her name fits her because 1) I chose Kanna as a reference to the Kanna from Inuyasha. Kanna’s full name in the manga means “god of nothingness/void” and how perfect is that for someone who lives their life to please the ideals and standards of society? It’s also…maybe foreshadowing what may be to come (I haven’t decided if she rejects all faith, but she’s struggling with her faith in the comic). 2) Kanna in Inuyasha is also created by Naraku: she isn’t a self made person/demon, someone else sculpts her. 3) Kanna also demonstrates how Rin’s so cut off from her Japanese heritage she doesn’t know the meaning behind the nickname she gave her friend: it’s kind of funny, though, that she gifted her overly religious friend the nickname of “godless” by accident. No one will get my sense of humor XD 3) I cut most of this out, but it’s a point that even “Kanna” isn’t a name she picked: it’s given to her by a friend. I won’t expound. Too involved. 4) Mirrors reflect because of light. Even the color white/light is the reflection of all colors. Her name fits her element when you look beyond the superficial.
Her given name is less important, and I put little thought into it because it becomes a dead name. I chose it because when I was a kid, “Candace/Candy” was a stereotype for popular/preppy/spoiled society kids. It’s also a little jab at the name because of the “Candies” shoe brand. If you were around in the 1990s, you might remember how “shocking” the ads with Jenny McCarthy** were at the time. I thought it was funny. It doesn’t matter, because the name doesn’t mean much to her (and after those ads, can you blame her? I remember laughing my ass off, but people were so “shocked” by them. If you were a girl in the 1990s reading YM or fashion magazines, you might remember this. If you weren’t, it doesn’t matter because those who get it, get it, and it isn’t important enough NEED to be gotten). I chose “Vanessa” as a middle name, because I like it the syllables of it I feel roll off the tongue. And the portmanteau of “Kannadessa” sounded properly pompous and unfitting for her: it marries the idea that neither name is her own and she must find her own name/self. Her last name is “Chase” because she’s always chasing other people’s concept of who she should be, and if she isn’t chasing that, she’s chasing after her friend’s identity because she envies the freedom she doesn’t feel she has. She has to realize in order to not lose, all she has to do is not play the game. Until then, that’s how we understand her given names. She rejects this name for Kanna, which is still a given name (and why she can’t move past being a person of nothing).
Odysseus as a character represents a lot (I won’t get into it all here, but even so its evolving). But we’ll go with the elemental stuff. He represents growth. I purposely chose a man to fill this role over a woman, because we always see women portraying “mother” nature and plants, and it’s just as much the male gender’s responsibility to “tend to the earth” as it is any other gender’s. But I also wanted to foster/set a precedent that not all these characters are going to play traditional gender roles. While he’s definitely masculine presenting, having been raised by a single parent, his mother, he embodies the sentiment of nurturing and caring. Later he develops healing qualities, which to me plants and herbs and the like reflect. Knowledge and growth are a part of his personality, and so it’s fitting that when he manifests an element, it is that of “wood” (or to be more accurate, plants in general).
His name DOESN’T fit him, that in and of itself IS the symbol. 1) His name demonstrates the benign ignorance of a mother who intended to give a Greek name and gave him one of the few Greek names she knew—it should be noted his father was a soccer player at her college, so it betrays her adoration for that “masculine” ideal (you wouldn’t be too far off from reading this as commentary on the West in general). It’s not to say she’s a bad person, but it demonstrates how our ideals we were raised with permeate and express themselves: it represents the idea of the ignorance many US citizens have regarding other cultures and the blind adoration of male leadership (I don’t want to say the “p” word XD). We don’t know any of this yet, but I’m telling you so you know their names have meaning. It also hints at how the “benign” can easily be a slippery slope into stereotypes that cause harm. 2) His name obscures who he truly is: not the hero of the story, but the weaver of stories. Once we get into Time Warp, this repeated joke is going to start becoming more evident. At any rate, he would have been better named Homer, but as referenced in point 1, his mom was blinded by the ideal of the “manly man” in mythology and chose that over a name that would better suit him. 3) I need to check and see if I show him irritated at the nickname “Yulie.” That was supposed to something I did, but you bringing this up may be a good reminder when I got back to make sure it’s in place. Because his eventual acceptance of the nickname speaks to his personality. He doesn’t like to “rock the boat” unless he’s forced to, and he’s more likely to resign himself that to fight for himself. This is contrasted again Kanna in that his resignation is more tied to not caring, or devaluing himself, rather than a desire to please or be something. It’s not a big difference in motivation, but the distinction should be noted. 4) The one way his name is fitting, is that he does go on an epic of a sort. So unlike Homer, he does have some agency. 5) He has a thorny maze of trauma he needs to unpack. It will hurt, but as thorns can cut, so too can plants salve and heal.
Thanks to your comment, I found a mistake I made years ago D: Yulie’s last name should have been “Rhodos,” not “Rhoros.” I have NO IDEA why I didn’t catch that, other than I probably looked it up and hand wrote it wrong (or maybe I misread my handwriting when I was typing this all in), but this was one of the few times I did want a connection with the element. “Rhodos” means rose or something like that in Greek. UGH. Thank you! I…need to change that in the biography. I need to change that everywhere. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!! That’s kind of an important juxtaposition for his first and last name. The “given” name was a mistake by his mom and dead wrong for him. But his last name, the one she didn’t give him was supposed to be more suited to him. I think I should change it…but it would almost be funny to leave the Freudian mistake to reflect on me. I made the mistake. I should have to own it XD
Oh, now I don’t know if I should keep it and own it as a mistake on my part and classic example of what his first name represents or if I should change it XD
You know, Naoko Takeuchi actually made a couple mistakes with the seishi? Jupiter is a planet on the other side of the astroid belt that separates the inner from the outer planets. But Jupiter was one of Usagi’s inner seishi. That’s technically wrong, but I guess she wanted four inner seishi XD A less comprehensible mistake is that the soldiers’ heights are supposed to correlate with the size of their planet. But Setsuna is far taller than Hotaru, even though Saturn is large and we now have disqualified Pluto as a planet because of its size and some other reason -maybe because it orbits something? I forget, but I was unreasonably angry at the time it was disqualified. Um…that’s just to say, even the professionals can make mistakes. Maybe she did it on purpose? I don’t know. It might be the point is Pluto is the farthest out so she needed to play that role she tossed the height thing out the window. Or it may be that we don’t ever really see Hotaru as an adult and she ended up taller than her? Hm…
Ahem. Anyway, I think that’s enough from me on that.
**I should note, while I label her correctly as pansexual here, in the story Rin will be mislabeled, and will mislabel herself, as “bisexual.” This is a period piece, and it wasn’t until recent years that our vernacular has grown to be closer to being more accurate to her sexuality.
**OMG, I googled Jenny McCarthy now and…what a hot mess. Not that I was all that enamored with her back in the day, but *phew* what is going on with people?
Just extra babble: A fun little tidbit most people won’t pick up on: Rin’s younger sister is the only one given a Japanese name. It is “Hana/花” (most Westerns mispronounce as Hannah), which is a pun on how the hippies were called “flower children” and hints at Rin’s mom’s sense of humor.
Another thought bobbing around in my head is that my first jrpg was The Legend of Dragoons. That game is another thing influencing me when I began. All the dragoons exhibit elements, but their names do not correspond to their element in the slightest (well, except Meru…that could have been inspired by “mermaid?” but that doesn’t make sense considering what race she is). I don’t know if that happened in the translation, but I don’t think so looking at the fandom page. I don’t know that their names had any meaning, really. It’s hard to find information on stuff like that sometimes.
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†I read W.i.t.c.h. several years ago. What a waste of potential that series was, smh.
I never read or watched that. I have heard of it, but it wasn’t on my radar since by the time it was I guess serialized as a cartoon I was well into college and reading/watching other stuff (I know Full Metal Alchemist was big on my mind at that time, both the manga and the OVA). Aside from Sailor Moon, the magical girl shows I grew up with are more along the lines of Rainbow Bright, She-Ra (the original, though I liked the reboot), Jem and the Holograms, PJ Sparkles, and Sabrina the Teenage Witch. By the time I realized there were more manga than Sailor Moon, the magical girl stuff I was reading was Magic Knight Rayearth, Revolutionary Girl Utena, and Fushigi Yuugi. I need to get back into the genre, since shows like Steven Universe, Puella Magi Madoka Magic, Kill La Kill, and Bee and Puppycat have help reignite my interest in newer stories.
I’ve been reading bits and pieces of Sleepless Domain. I just started chapter three. I know this seems slow, but I am subscribed a ton of smaller indie comickers on Tapas and ComicFury, and I’m very behind on reading them D: That said, I’ve been enjoying it so far! Thank you for the suggestion 😀 I will keep on with it.
A little short on time today, so I’ll keep it brief(ish).
Reality Subtext (aka real life):
Thanks for thinking of me all this time, even though I’m just a rando on the internet. (*/ω＼*) I probably won’t be going into detail on any activism I do, mainly to avoid taking over the comments even more. (Just think of it as a status update, I guess.)
Funny you should mention boundaries; I was worried I’d crossed a line too! My last bit of feedback was pretty harsh and full of subjectives, and even I felt like I was doing exactly what I set out to avoid (i.e., dunking on something out of disapproval). But I really appreciate that you took the time to offer more context, especially since it clears up a good chunk of the issues I had with the plot and characterization.
You’re welcome for the rec, by the way, although the real MVP is TV Tropes. Seriously. I found Sleepless Domain pretty much by random on there. (It was through a screencap on a handwriting trope, I forgot which one.)
Elemental affinities:
Valid on the subversion here, and I think I can see why you made that particular choice. I do like that you try to emphasize how each character is more than just their element, and how they can choose the element they want to wield rather than simply awakening some hitherto-dormant magic inside themselves.
That said…I gotta take some points off for finding this out through Word of God, aka your commentary. Even after reading the pages you linked, I still can’t say I think it was evident Rin was choosing her element. I blame the oceanic deity for this, especially with the way they addressed Rin as “little pearl of the sea” (also why I was confused about Rin’s apparent affinity for water), their outsized amount of dialogue compared to Rin, and their much larger size. I personally would have liked to see more emphasis on Rin’s train of thought right up to her awakening, or perhaps a brief exchange where someone, not necessarily any specific deity or entity, asks Rin which element she’d like to wield.
Names and personalities:
…that is a lot to unpack. @_@ I’m going to respond to that in private when I’ve cleared up some more time.
I do want to ask if we could avoid the spoilers in the comments, though? I do like reading about your creative process, but I have concerns that other readers of Dark Horse may be put off by all the spoilers/future knowledge being unleashed here, not to mention–and sorry if this sounds snippy–you do have a habit of (over)explaining your process in response to feedback. As a gentle reminder, I’m approaching Dark Horse as someone who’s pretty much new to the series. I can’t offer honest, effective feedback as a newbie if I also know what’s going on behind the scenes or later in the comic.
Oh, and you’re welcome on the naming typo, I guess? 😅 I’d ask if Odysseus is blushing over that, but oh look that’s a bad pun no more time to leave now bye.
Click this sentence to read. I put it in a box so it didn’t take up the whole page XD.
Reality Subtext (aka real life): I probably won’t be going into detail on any activism I do, mainly to avoid taking over the comments even more. (Just think of it as a status update, I guess.)
Totally understandable! I will not press the matter.
That said…I gotta take some points off for finding this out through Word of God, aka your commentary. Even after reading the pages you linked, I still can’t say I think it was evident Rin was choosing her element.
Okay, fair enough. I would explain, but instead, let’s do this: ask yourself why Rhina isn’t talking to the being. What has just happened to her? Think about the conscious and the subconscious. Think about involuntary response. Look at her expressions and the pages coming right before that (ugh, albeit the eyes are too far apart on one…le sigh).
The same is going to hold true when you get to Yulie’s awakening: there’s a reason he’s not talking. You’re intelligent, you can figure it out. I’m not a great writer, but I have my reasons for certain things. And the worse stories over explain. Sure, I may explain in the comments, but I’m going to try to stop doing that, and put the question to you, or let you know when you’ve given me stuff to revise.
A concession on the dialogue: I can help better convey Rin’s subconscious choice by having the being say “you called out to me” or something like that. What do you think? Would that help demonstrate her autonomy a bit, while maintaining her silence?
Kanna’s awakening is a bit different and contains more of what you ask (though she doesn’t KNOW she’s doing this, so you’re not going get her saying “I choose this element”).
I blame the oceanic deity for this, especially with the way they addressed Rin as “little pearl of the sea” (also why I was confused about Rin’s apparent affinity for water), their outsized amount of dialogue compared to Rin, and their much larger size. I personally would have liked to see more emphasis on Rin’s train of thought right up to her awakening, or perhaps a brief exchange where someone, not necessarily any specific deity or entity, asks Rin which element she’d like to wield.
There’s a reason they say “pearl.” It’s got nothing to do Rin choosing an elements-that’s a red-hering. Look closely at that being. Look at their horns. Think about the element. Why would a pearl be pertinent? Think about that. The being is calling something precious, a “treasure”/soul a pearl. Another hint, I intentionally show this with the other being. I won’t give you the answer. But if you look closely, you can figure out why. I have faith in you. The pearl is a mislead: it’s not about the water. That term betrays what this being is and is foreshadowing. I’m building up slowly.
Names and personalities: …that is a lot to unpack. @_@ I’m going to respond to that in private when I’ve cleared up some more time.
Sounds good.
I do want to ask if we could avoid the spoilers in the comments, though? I do like reading about your creative process, but I have concerns that other readers of Dark Horse may be put off by all the spoilers/future knowledge being unleashed here,
I will retroactively try to put “spoiler” drop downs on the comments I think need them; as I find time. It may take a bit of time to find them all. I had to look up the coding since WordPress doesn’t have a shortcut for it. I feel they should have that as a shortcut, but that is just one of WordPress’ follies XD
not to mention–and sorry if this sounds snippy–you do have a habit of (over)explaining your process in response to feedback. As a gentle reminder, I’m approaching Dark Horse as someone who’s pretty much new to the series. I can’t offer honest, effective feedback as a newbie if I also know what’s going on behind the scenes or later in the comic.
Please, I consider this comment a bit rude (in regards to saying I over explain). Now let me over explain why I feel this way (the irony is not lost on me that I’m still explaining: please bear with me! This is how humans reach understanding rather than jumping down each other’s throats).
In spite of some of your terser comments, I’ve been careful to respond without showing anger, even when my initial response is anger.
I over explain, because often there seems to be a question, or a misinterpretation I want to clarify. And to be honest, on all my mirror sites where I have the most reader interaction, people want to talk and have discussions. They like hearing what I have to say, and vice versa. I explain also, because you clearly put time and effort into looking up character names (well, your comments in general), and I misunderstood that to be your interest in the names. I wanted to give the response as much thought and care as I viewed you’d put into looking into the names. Additionally, I’ll admit I was very excited to get a chance to talk about them! It’s not going to fit into the story very naturally, so I finally got a chance to divulge some extra information about the names. It’s not important to bring up in the story. They’re there, and people will get more out of the characters if they figure this out, but they’re not needed to understand what’s going on. It’s just fun bonus stuff. Because most authors absolutely love assigning meaning to names XD But others? Yeah, there’s a lot who just pick names at random. After I got your comment, I actually discussed this with some of my peers and we had a pretty cool conversation about whether or not they do the elemental thing, or if they think about the names and so on so forth. So I really just…enjoy talking about this stuff XD
I will try to stop explaining as much from here on out, as I mention above. In many cases with your comments, I’ve really worked already on reserving what I say. But I’ll work harder at it.
Oh, and you’re welcome on the naming typo, I guess?
I’d ask if Odysseus is blushing over that, but oh look that’s a bad pun no more time to leave now bye.
4 Comments
First off, I am so, SO sorry for the sudden silence several months ago. I got swamped with lobbying campaigns during the end of the last Congress, on top of dealing with recurrent depression and social anxiety, and I was afraid as well that I’d crossed the line with my previous comment. Sorry for the acerbic tone, by the way, and thanks for the detailed explanations. You’ve put a lot of thought into your chronology.
I’m still adjusting my schedule so I’m not as overwhelmed, but I just wanted to let you know I read your responses and will be (slowly) getting back into leaving feedback. I also won’t be commenting on busy textures in the art anymore unless they’re especially egregious, since you’re reworking older pages anyway.
Oh, and by the way, remember how I previously kept mentioning a certain vital plot point that I felt wasn’t handled well? This was it.
I reread the sequence leading up to Rin’s arcane awakening, and I’m still scratching my head over why she is a waterbend—er, user of water magic. There’s no foreshadowing in the preceding acts for her connections to the ocean, nor any motifs or symbolism suggesting the sort. Not even her given name helps, nor her nicknames*. Apparently Rhiannon is partly derived from a Welsh root meaning “maiden”, and Rhiannon of the Mabinogi doesn’t seem to have any special affinity for the sea, as far as I can tell. And Rin can be written in so many different ways in Japanese, it’s just impossible to guess which kanji is involved (if any).
I’d buy into Rin as Sailor Mercury if she, oh I dunno, really liked spending time at the beach. Or often smelled like sea salt. Or had a preference for clothing colored like the ocean. Or was at least named after something aquatic, as Mizuno Ami and Undine Wells from Sleepless Domain are. But instead she suffers a near-death experience and is suddenly, conveniently rescued by a hitherto-absent thalassic deity who turns her into the Guardian of Water†. Yeah, I’m not convinced.
Anyway, I dunno if this is something you’re revising, but you might want to add it to the list. It’s a pretty jarring shift for Rin to go from being a normie to transforming into 🌊Alchemical Water 🌊.
*Technically Rhina counts…if you’re thinking of the shark genus. But it ultimately comes from Greek “rhínē”, “nose”. 🧐
†I read W.i.t.c.h. several years ago. What a waste of potential that series was, smh.
Hey! I’m glad to see you’re okay. I figured you had stuff to do, but was also a little worried (and debating on if I should check in and see if you were okay, but then I thought “is that weird and overstepping boundaries?” So I let it be. I don’t know what’s proper Internet etiquette XD But you were on my mind, and I was relieved just to see you were okay.
Nah, you’re fine. I’m sorry if at any point I came off as terse, too XD That’s not my intent. Sometimes I get busy and pour over my comments for like hours and then I look at the time and panic (last year was very busy. But this year should be a bit of relief once I take care of some unfinished business from last year). And as I’ve said before, no pressure from this side. Life is busy, life is fleeting. You’ve gotta do the things that matter to you while you can: your work and activism is important to you, and it’s good that you prioritize it.
At any rate, I hope things have been going well with the campaigning. If you feel like talking about that, I’d be interested if it was the work you were doing last time we talked. Don’t share anything you feel uncomfortable discussing, though.
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Sorry if I have typos. I read this a couple times, but I don’t have Word and the Notes program I use keeps autocorrecting everything D:
Thank you for clarifying what was confusing to you! I don’t know if this will make anything clear or not, but this is another divergence from the way magical girls are done traditionally. Having read your comment, I can compromise only on doing better associating their colors with them, and I’ll explain the names and their importance below. Also, I’ll touch up on it, but there are characters who exhibit the elements and have names that in some way are reminiscent of the element. These two here 1. 2. are the only ones we see so far, but they aren’t introduced until like…the next to the last series (or last series, if I decide that’s enough. I think I may just scrap the last one).
TL:DR—
I take my character’s names very seriously, as does I’m sure everyone. Their names have a purpose and meaning. And they are not dictated by an “innate” element. They choose the element, not vice versa (“choice” is important; there are characters named after their element, but that is rare because I place the symbolism on personality vs. powers; but that said, their powers are indicative of their personalities.
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SPOILERS! Don’t read if you don’t want spoilers! Thank you!
More Detailed Explanation—
(If you’d like more, let me know and I’ll email it. I don’t want too many spoilers, and I think this answers your question on why I chose each name.)
Names are not tied to the element: the elements are manifested by them. They are not controlled by a destiny of whatever element they manifest. While I appreciate other authors utilizing this trope, I have no desire to exhibit it in most cases. Other people have done this enough, and they can do it better than I can. I have the freedom to do other things with my characters’ names, and I intend to pack meaning elsewhere. And much of my symbolism is taken from the things I consumed in childhood, college, and the present. Dark Horse isn’t really like other magical girl comics, and I don’t want it to be. I love and enjoy the genre, but I don’t feel obligated to follow a formula. As mentioned, other people do better with that than I ever could. I have my own priorities.
Rhiannon as a character represents freedom and fluidity. She’s a pansexual* ‘90s hippie chick. She “goes with the flow” and she most identifies with the element water. She chose the element, not the other way around. Her element was not preordained by fate or someone else naming her; it was chosen by her, and reciprocated by the being who responded to her call. Her namesake was from a misinterpretation of the Welsh goddess of horses; Rhiannon was thought by many to be a “Welsh witch” because of the Fleetwood Mac song named after Triad by Mary Bartlett Leader. Her name is spot on for what I want her character to represent. It’s perfect to her because 1) Horses represent freedom and spirituality to western artists, as does the color blue. 2) The misinterpretation tells you from the get go Rin is a “magical girl” or witch. Even if Stevie Nicks initially made a mistake in thinking Rhiannon was a witch, most people who know the song know it’s about a witch. 3) The name is tied to a counter culture band of the 1960/70s (they were more poppy in the 80s), which implies a direct confrontation with societal norms. This is doubled because her parents named her after a “witch” in part because they love the song, they love the name, but in part as a reaction to being in the thick of the 1980s Satanic Panic, and they never “sold out.” It was a “middle finger” to mass hysteria. 4) Already having a lot of symbolism, Rhina herself loves the fact that she can choose between many nicknames; Rhina which feels more like her Gælic roots, or Rin which fits her Japanese roots. It, like her, is fluid. 5) Fluidity of personality is key to her element. She reached out to the being we see at the time of her awakening, because that being, whose *spoiler* called (“called” is important diction, as names have power and their true name is never given) Mizuna, is an embodiment of that element. Sidenote: Rin isn’t written with any kanji. She writes it with katakana (not hiragana). Because it’s the Japanese alphabet for foreign words, so that her that makes the most sense. She’s not a Japanese national, and she can’t read Japanese (beyond knowing a few words and phrases). She is a US citizen of mixed lineage.
Kanna as a character represents conformity. She’s a repressed teenager who’s been conditioned into guilt and conforming to what society believes she should be. She isn’t the light, but she choses light as her element because she is trying to fill the expectation of being a “good” “holy” person, while failing because the standard of “purity” is unrealistic and unattainable. But part of why she does this, and why the being who responds to her answers, is that deep down she does love and care for people, which is her true reason for putting so much pressure on herself. Two things can be true at once.
Her name fits her because 1) I chose Kanna as a reference to the Kanna from Inuyasha. Kanna’s full name in the manga means “god of nothingness/void” and how perfect is that for someone who lives their life to please the ideals and standards of society? It’s also…maybe foreshadowing what may be to come (I haven’t decided if she rejects all faith, but she’s struggling with her faith in the comic). 2) Kanna in Inuyasha is also created by Naraku: she isn’t a self made person/demon, someone else sculpts her. 3) Kanna also demonstrates how Rin’s so cut off from her Japanese heritage she doesn’t know the meaning behind the nickname she gave her friend: it’s kind of funny, though, that she gifted her overly religious friend the nickname of “godless” by accident. No one will get my sense of humor XD 3) I cut most of this out, but it’s a point that even “Kanna” isn’t a name she picked: it’s given to her by a friend. I won’t expound. Too involved. 4) Mirrors reflect because of light. Even the color white/light is the reflection of all colors. Her name fits her element when you look beyond the superficial.
Her given name is less important, and I put little thought into it because it becomes a dead name. I chose it because when I was a kid, “Candace/Candy” was a stereotype for popular/preppy/spoiled society kids. It’s also a little jab at the name because of the “Candies” shoe brand. If you were around in the 1990s, you might remember how “shocking” the ads with Jenny McCarthy** were at the time. I thought it was funny. It doesn’t matter, because the name doesn’t mean much to her (and after those ads, can you blame her? I remember laughing my ass off, but people were so “shocked” by them. If you were a girl in the 1990s reading YM or fashion magazines, you might remember this. If you weren’t, it doesn’t matter because those who get it, get it, and it isn’t important enough NEED to be gotten). I chose “Vanessa” as a middle name, because I like it the syllables of it I feel roll off the tongue. And the portmanteau of “Kannadessa” sounded properly pompous and unfitting for her: it marries the idea that neither name is her own and she must find her own name/self. Her last name is “Chase” because she’s always chasing other people’s concept of who she should be, and if she isn’t chasing that, she’s chasing after her friend’s identity because she envies the freedom she doesn’t feel she has. She has to realize in order to not lose, all she has to do is not play the game. Until then, that’s how we understand her given names. She rejects this name for Kanna, which is still a given name (and why she can’t move past being a person of nothing).
Odysseus as a character represents a lot (I won’t get into it all here, but even so its evolving). But we’ll go with the elemental stuff. He represents growth. I purposely chose a man to fill this role over a woman, because we always see women portraying “mother” nature and plants, and it’s just as much the male gender’s responsibility to “tend to the earth” as it is any other gender’s. But I also wanted to foster/set a precedent that not all these characters are going to play traditional gender roles. While he’s definitely masculine presenting, having been raised by a single parent, his mother, he embodies the sentiment of nurturing and caring. Later he develops healing qualities, which to me plants and herbs and the like reflect. Knowledge and growth are a part of his personality, and so it’s fitting that when he manifests an element, it is that of “wood” (or to be more accurate, plants in general).
His name DOESN’T fit him, that in and of itself IS the symbol. 1) His name demonstrates the benign ignorance of a mother who intended to give a Greek name and gave him one of the few Greek names she knew—it should be noted his father was a soccer player at her college, so it betrays her adoration for that “masculine” ideal (you wouldn’t be too far off from reading this as commentary on the West in general). It’s not to say she’s a bad person, but it demonstrates how our ideals we were raised with permeate and express themselves: it represents the idea of the ignorance many US citizens have regarding other cultures and the blind adoration of male leadership (I don’t want to say the “p” word XD). We don’t know any of this yet, but I’m telling you so you know their names have meaning. It also hints at how the “benign” can easily be a slippery slope into stereotypes that cause harm. 2) His name obscures who he truly is: not the hero of the story, but the weaver of stories. Once we get into Time Warp, this repeated joke is going to start becoming more evident. At any rate, he would have been better named Homer, but as referenced in point 1, his mom was blinded by the ideal of the “manly man” in mythology and chose that over a name that would better suit him. 3) I need to check and see if I show him irritated at the nickname “Yulie.” That was supposed to something I did, but you bringing this up may be a good reminder when I got back to make sure it’s in place. Because his eventual acceptance of the nickname speaks to his personality. He doesn’t like to “rock the boat” unless he’s forced to, and he’s more likely to resign himself that to fight for himself. This is contrasted again Kanna in that his resignation is more tied to not caring, or devaluing himself, rather than a desire to please or be something. It’s not a big difference in motivation, but the distinction should be noted. 4) The one way his name is fitting, is that he does go on an epic of a sort. So unlike Homer, he does have some agency. 5) He has a thorny maze of trauma he needs to unpack. It will hurt, but as thorns can cut, so too can plants salve and heal.
Thanks to your comment, I found a mistake I made years ago D: Yulie’s last name should have been “Rhodos,” not “Rhoros.” I have NO IDEA why I didn’t catch that, other than I probably looked it up and hand wrote it wrong (or maybe I misread my handwriting when I was typing this all in), but this was one of the few times I did want a connection with the element. “Rhodos” means rose or something like that in Greek. UGH. Thank you! I…need to change that in the biography. I need to change that everywhere. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!! That’s kind of an important juxtaposition for his first and last name. The “given” name was a mistake by his mom and dead wrong for him. But his last name, the one she didn’t give him was supposed to be more suited to him. I think I should change it…but it would almost be funny to leave the Freudian mistake to reflect on me. I made the mistake. I should have to own it XD
Oh, now I don’t know if I should keep it and own it as a mistake on my part and classic example of what his first name represents or if I should change it XD
You know, Naoko Takeuchi actually made a couple mistakes with the seishi? Jupiter is a planet on the other side of the astroid belt that separates the inner from the outer planets. But Jupiter was one of Usagi’s inner seishi. That’s technically wrong, but I guess she wanted four inner seishi XD A less comprehensible mistake is that the soldiers’ heights are supposed to correlate with the size of their planet. But Setsuna is far taller than Hotaru, even though Saturn is large and we now have disqualified Pluto as a planet because of its size and some other reason -maybe because it orbits something? I forget, but I was unreasonably angry at the time it was disqualified. Um…that’s just to say, even the professionals can make mistakes. Maybe she did it on purpose? I don’t know. It might be the point is Pluto is the farthest out so she needed to play that role she tossed the height thing out the window. Or it may be that we don’t ever really see Hotaru as an adult and she ended up taller than her? Hm…
Ahem. Anyway, I think that’s enough from me on that.
**I should note, while I label her correctly as pansexual here, in the story Rin will be mislabeled, and will mislabel herself, as “bisexual.” This is a period piece, and it wasn’t until recent years that our vernacular has grown to be closer to being more accurate to her sexuality.
**OMG, I googled Jenny McCarthy now and…what a hot mess. Not that I was all that enamored with her back in the day, but *phew* what is going on with people?
Just extra babble: A fun little tidbit most people won’t pick up on: Rin’s younger sister is the only one given a Japanese name. It is “Hana/花” (most Westerns mispronounce as Hannah), which is a pun on how the hippies were called “flower children” and hints at Rin’s mom’s sense of humor.
Another thought bobbing around in my head is that my first jrpg was The Legend of Dragoons. That game is another thing influencing me when I began. All the dragoons exhibit elements, but their names do not correspond to their element in the slightest (well, except Meru…that could have been inspired by “mermaid?” but that doesn’t make sense considering what race she is). I don’t know if that happened in the translation, but I don’t think so looking at the fandom page. I don’t know that their names had any meaning, really. It’s hard to find information on stuff like that sometimes.
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I never read or watched that. I have heard of it, but it wasn’t on my radar since by the time it was I guess serialized as a cartoon I was well into college and reading/watching other stuff (I know Full Metal Alchemist was big on my mind at that time, both the manga and the OVA). Aside from Sailor Moon, the magical girl shows I grew up with are more along the lines of Rainbow Bright, She-Ra (the original, though I liked the reboot), Jem and the Holograms, PJ Sparkles, and Sabrina the Teenage Witch. By the time I realized there were more manga than Sailor Moon, the magical girl stuff I was reading was Magic Knight Rayearth, Revolutionary Girl Utena, and Fushigi Yuugi. I need to get back into the genre, since shows like Steven Universe, Puella Magi Madoka Magic, Kill La Kill, and Bee and Puppycat have help reignite my interest in newer stories.
I’ve been reading bits and pieces of Sleepless Domain. I just started chapter three. I know this seems slow, but I am subscribed a ton of smaller indie comickers on Tapas and ComicFury, and I’m very behind on reading them D: That said, I’ve been enjoying it so far! Thank you for the suggestion 😀 I will keep on with it.
A little short on time today, so I’ll keep it brief(ish).
Reality Subtext (aka real life):
Thanks for thinking of me all this time, even though I’m just a rando on the internet. (*/ω＼*) I probably won’t be going into detail on any activism I do, mainly to avoid taking over the comments even more. (Just think of it as a status update, I guess.)
Funny you should mention boundaries; I was worried I’d crossed a line too! My last bit of feedback was pretty harsh and full of subjectives, and even I felt like I was doing exactly what I set out to avoid (i.e., dunking on something out of disapproval). But I really appreciate that you took the time to offer more context, especially since it clears up a good chunk of the issues I had with the plot and characterization.
You’re welcome for the rec, by the way, although the real MVP is TV Tropes. Seriously. I found Sleepless Domain pretty much by random on there. (It was through a screencap on a handwriting trope, I forgot which one.)
Elemental affinities:
Valid on the subversion here, and I think I can see why you made that particular choice. I do like that you try to emphasize how each character is more than just their element, and how they can choose the element they want to wield rather than simply awakening some hitherto-dormant magic inside themselves.
That said…I gotta take some points off for finding this out through Word of God, aka your commentary. Even after reading the pages you linked, I still can’t say I think it was evident Rin was choosing her element. I blame the oceanic deity for this, especially with the way they addressed Rin as “little pearl of the sea” (also why I was confused about Rin’s apparent affinity for water), their outsized amount of dialogue compared to Rin, and their much larger size. I personally would have liked to see more emphasis on Rin’s train of thought right up to her awakening, or perhaps a brief exchange where someone, not necessarily any specific deity or entity, asks Rin which element she’d like to wield.
Names and personalities:
…that is a lot to unpack. @_@ I’m going to respond to that in private when I’ve cleared up some more time.
I do want to ask if we could avoid the spoilers in the comments, though? I do like reading about your creative process, but I have concerns that other readers of Dark Horse may be put off by all the spoilers/future knowledge being unleashed here, not to mention–and sorry if this sounds snippy–you do have a habit of (over)explaining your process in response to feedback. As a gentle reminder, I’m approaching Dark Horse as someone who’s pretty much new to the series. I can’t offer honest, effective feedback as a newbie if I also know what’s going on behind the scenes or later in the comic.
Oh, and you’re welcome on the naming typo, I guess? 😅 I’d ask if Odysseus is blushing over that, but oh look that’s a bad pun no more time to leave now bye.
Click this sentence to read. I put it in a box so it didn’t take up the whole page XD.
Totally understandable! I will not press the matter.
Okay, fair enough. I would explain, but instead, let’s do this: ask yourself why Rhina isn’t talking to the being. What has just happened to her? Think about the conscious and the subconscious. Think about involuntary response. Look at her expressions and the pages coming right before that (ugh, albeit the eyes are too far apart on one…le sigh).
The same is going to hold true when you get to Yulie’s awakening: there’s a reason he’s not talking. You’re intelligent, you can figure it out. I’m not a great writer, but I have my reasons for certain things. And the worse stories over explain. Sure, I may explain in the comments, but I’m going to try to stop doing that, and put the question to you, or let you know when you’ve given me stuff to revise.
A concession on the dialogue: I can help better convey Rin’s subconscious choice by having the being say “you called out to me” or something like that. What do you think? Would that help demonstrate her autonomy a bit, while maintaining her silence?
Kanna’s awakening is a bit different and contains more of what you ask (though she doesn’t KNOW she’s doing this, so you’re not going get her saying “I choose this element”).
There’s a reason they say “pearl.” It’s got nothing to do Rin choosing an elements-that’s a red-hering. Look closely at that being. Look at their horns. Think about the element. Why would a pearl be pertinent? Think about that. The being is calling something precious, a “treasure”/soul a pearl. Another hint, I intentionally show this with the other being. I won’t give you the answer. But if you look closely, you can figure out why. I have faith in you. The pearl is a mislead: it’s not about the water. That term betrays what this being is and is foreshadowing. I’m building up slowly.
Sounds good.
I will retroactively try to put “spoiler” drop downs on the comments I think need them; as I find time. It may take a bit of time to find them all. I had to look up the coding since WordPress doesn’t have a shortcut for it. I feel they should have that as a shortcut, but that is just one of WordPress’ follies XD
Please, I consider this comment a bit rude (in regards to saying I over explain). Now let me over explain why I feel this way (the irony is not lost on me that I’m still explaining: please bear with me! This is how humans reach understanding rather than jumping down each other’s throats).
In spite of some of your terser comments, I’ve been careful to respond without showing anger, even when my initial response is anger.
I over explain, because often there seems to be a question, or a misinterpretation I want to clarify. And to be honest, on all my mirror sites where I have the most reader interaction, people want to talk and have discussions. They like hearing what I have to say, and vice versa. I explain also, because you clearly put time and effort into looking up character names (well, your comments in general), and I misunderstood that to be your interest in the names. I wanted to give the response as much thought and care as I viewed you’d put into looking into the names. Additionally, I’ll admit I was very excited to get a chance to talk about them! It’s not going to fit into the story very naturally, so I finally got a chance to divulge some extra information about the names. It’s not important to bring up in the story. They’re there, and people will get more out of the characters if they figure this out, but they’re not needed to understand what’s going on. It’s just fun bonus stuff. Because most authors absolutely love assigning meaning to names XD But others? Yeah, there’s a lot who just pick names at random. After I got your comment, I actually discussed this with some of my peers and we had a pretty cool conversation about whether or not they do the elemental thing, or if they think about the names and so on so forth. So I really just…enjoy talking about this stuff XD
I will try to stop explaining as much from here on out, as I mention above. In many cases with your comments, I’ve really worked already on reserving what I say. But I’ll work harder at it.
Bad puns are always welcome XD I relish them.